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 Добавлено: 29 ноя 2009, 15:20
аДумаю со временем перебраться в Канаду. Может у кого был опыт проживания сразу в дыух этих странах, где лучше?

Общая информация

Geography & Resources: Canada and the United States are both very large nations, making up the vast majority of the North American continent. Canada has slightly larger territory, and the US has slightly more land. On a physical map the two countries appear to be on an equal footing, but in reality much of Canada is unsuitable for normal living conditions due to the very cold climate. This has resulted in the majority of Canada's population living along a long strip of land straddling the US border (see Canada population distribution map). Even so, the large geography of Canada does contain a great many natural resources, including one of the world's largest fresh water supplies. Although not counted as a renewable freshwater resource, Canada and the US share the the Great Lakes, which contain nearly 6 quadrillion gallons of water.13 Combined, Canada and the US would make the largest nation on Earth with the largest amount of freshwater supply.

Population: The largest advantage the US has over Canada is its much larger population. The US and Canadian growth rates are fairly comparable, but the way they are growing is quite different. Canada's growth is supported much more by a higher immigration rate. The absolute number of immigrants to the US is much greater, but on a per capita basis Canada's migrant rate is nearly double that of the US. Likewise, the US birth rate is much higher than Canada's. Even when combined with the higher death rate, the US internal growth rate is nearly double Canada's. This results in Canada becoming more foreign, and the US becoming more USAmerican, at least on paper. One must consider the uncounted number of illegal migrants, which some estimate are coming at a rate of 500,000 a month.14 Due to the fact that Canada does not share a border with a less developed nation, illegal immigration is much less of a problem.
The US Census Bureau and Statistics Canada classify ethnic groups differently, and therefore a true comparison between the two is difficult. However, Statistics Canada does record "Visible Minorities" so some inferences can be made. The US statistic above was calculated by looking at "one race only" results and ignoring all races which could not be assigned to either White, Black, Asian or Native American. Original data can be viewed from this link. The Canadian statistic above was calculated by classifying all Blacks as "Black", all South Asian, Chinese, Korean, Japanese, Southeast Asian, and Filipinos as "Asian", all Aboriginals as "Native", and all others as "White". We can see according to this estimate that Canada has slightly more Whites, one sixth as many Blacks, over two times as many Asians, and over three times as many Native Americans, proportionally. As with life expectancy and religious affiliation, these are less to do with national differences and have more to do with regional differences. For example, Washington State's ethnic population makeup is as follows: White 81.8%, Asian 5.5%, Black 3.2%, and Native 1.6%.5 By and large, northern states, like their Canadian provincial counterparts, tend to have less Blacks and more Natives. Additionally, life expectancies tend to be slightly higher among northern states (See: Average Life Expectancy at Birth by State). The difference in religious beliefs is mainly due to high proportion of French-Canadian Catholics located primarily in the Province of Quebec. The Catholics of Quebec account for nearly half of all Catholics in Canada and thus highly skew the national figures.

Economy: It is well known that the US has had the strongest economy in the world since the post WWII era. Comparatively, the US has more than double the GDP of the second highest ranked country, Japan, which is just over 4.6 trillion.15 However, the statistic that really shows how well a country is doing comparative to their population is the GDP per capita figure. In this category, the US lists within the top ten countries of the world. It outperforms Canada by nearly 18%, and China, the 4th largest world economy, by 24.7 times.15 In 2004, the most current year data is available, the US posted a much better GDP growth rate, but over the long term both Canada and the US are growing at very comparable rates.
Economics is obviously a complicated area and there are many factors to consider, but one major factor that helps the US maintain its strength in the global economy and in comparison to Canada in particular, is its large domestic market. Interestingly, if the European Union is counted as a nation, it would have a larger GDP than the United States, but Canada and the United States combined would make the world's largest economy.

Military: One of the main reasons why the US spends so much on its military is that it is the economic leader of the world. Holding that place makes enemies of smaller, less wealthy countries and/or groups that oppose the fundamental beliefs of democracy and freedom that the United States stands for. For example, North Korea spends approximately 31% of its GDP on its military, while its people literally starve. Many other hostile countries do not publicly give out information on military expenditures. However, it is well known that countries such as Iran, Libya, and others are in the process of seeking or already possess nuclear, chemical and biological weapons. As the only remaining superpower in the world, the United States sees itself as obligated to try and keep peace and order. Many people may oppose actions that the US takes or has taken to fulfill that obligation, but if not for the US, many aggressive land-hungry nations would be waging bloody wars every day. Canada plays a part in keeping the peace, though its political support greatly outweighs its military contributions. Many First or Second World countries, and a few Third World countries have the ability to defeat Canada alone in a military engagement. However, Canada is one of the safest places in the world to live because the US is immediately west and south of it.

Representatives of Government:
What the above figures illustrate, is that on a comparative level Canada has a much bigger government. Although it is debatable whether much of Parliaments back-benchers or the 105 un-elected Senators actually represent Canada, this does all cost the Canadian taxpayer much more than the US taxpayer. This is simply because Canada does not have the population base to justify such a huge government.

UN rating: The once much emphasized fact by many Canadian nationalists. Until recently Canada has been rated #1 by the UN. Beginning in 2003 UNDP report rated Canada as #8 overall, and the United States #7. Canadians and Americans alike shouldn't feel too bad about this. The United Nations is an organization which has very noble humanitarian causes, such as "ending world hunger", "eliminating racial and gender inequalities", "reducing the economical gap between the rich and poor" as well as others. These are all problems that if could be fixed, would make the world a better place. However, the HDI rating takes into account only three very simple characteristics of a country: Life Expectancy, Literacy/Enrollment and PPP. Hardly a basis for declaring the "best country in the world".

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 Добавлено: 29 ноя 2009, 16:09
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Тяжёлый вопрос. Вам никто однозначно не ответит. Я встречал людей которые нашли работу в сша но живут в канаде. Есть такие которые переезжают жить туда. А есть которые едут оттуда. В канаде жизнь более зашищена, но больше налогов.В сша наоборот больше денег но нет таких социальных программ. Я считаю что всё зависит от работы. И самый лучший вариант иметь канадское гражданство но работать в америке, но если там пойдёт чего то не так можно всегда вернутся в канаду.

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 Добавлено: 29 ноя 2009, 17:48
Лично на мой взгляд у каждого свои преимущества и недостатки.
Почему Америка.

1) Выше уровень жизни (в первую очередь зарплаты выше).

2) Легче найти работу. Рынок труда помощнее хотя и немного жестокий.

3) Выбор удобного климата, всегда можно переехать в штат с разным климатом. Любите жару - Аризона, море - Флорида, холод - Мичиган что нибудь по середине - Калифорния , а в Канаде все одно либо холодно либо очень холодно. Дажев самом южном городе Канады зимой лопатой драйв-вэй будете отчищать.

4) Выбор городов велик.

5) И как правило заметил Плуто, налоги ниже.

6) Меньше государственная бюрократия. В Канаде знакомый год не мог получить права, в США получаешь очень быстро и сразу обычные, независимо от стажа.

Почему Канада.

1)Легче попасть. Набрал баллы и приехал , а в США либо выиграть, либо долго ждать.

2) Недвижимость дешевле.

3) Через 3 года получаешь гражданство, в США 5 лет.

4) Лучше социальные условия.

5) Меньше черных и мексиканцев (если это для вас важно, конечно).

И т.д и т.п

Для пенсионеров и семей (особенно с маленькими детьми) лучше в Канаду, там социальная база получше и экология, а если вы молоды, IMHO, лучше в США - возможностей для реализации больше. И учтите, что экономика Канады напрямую зависит от американской, примерно как украинская от российской со всеми вытекающими последствиями. А вообще, каждый свое болото хвалит, так что канадцы будут защищать Канаду, а американцы Америку. А житель мухосранска будет иметь свое мнение.


Последний раз редактировалось Alert 30 ноя 2009, 08:29, всего редактировалось 3 раз(а).
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 Добавлено: 29 ноя 2009, 18:28
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В принципе Alert правельно всё описал:
1) Выше уровень жизни (в первую очередь зарплаты выше).

Но, вы не забывайте что вам нужно будет платить страховку вашего здоровья. Конечно многие молодые не думают об этом, но всё же лучше платить..Аlert хорошо сказал что если вы молоды то тогда всё нормально. Но то что там зарплаты выше то это факт.

7) Меньше черных и мексиканцев (если это для вас важно, конечно).

А вот с этим можно поспорить (если это для вас важно, конечно). Все кто был в США говарят что там больше чёрных чем в Канаде.Да и мексиканцев там тоже больше, вы можете это понять когда увидите надписи на английском и испанском языке, особенно в южных районах США. Даже в Нью-Йорке есть такие надписи на банкоматах. Даже ходила как то шутка что нужно в США сделать испанский вторым официальным языком.
А так всё верно написано.

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 Добавлено: 29 ноя 2009, 18:38
pluto писал(а):
А вот с этим можно поспорить (если это для вас важно, конечно).

Прошу прощения, это я записался :) Это я хотел в плюсы Канады, но забыл их написать. Уже исправил. Конечно черных здесь больше чем в Канаде (в городах южных штатов, например в Новом Орлеане, их вроде даже больше чем белых), и по моему это недостаток ибо среди них высокий уровень безработных и преступности. Мексиканцы больше работают, но как правило они тоже склонны к криминалу. В Майами например, в основном латиносы, в Новом Орлеане как уже говорил, черные, и эти два города на ряду с Детройтом являются самыми преступными в США. Про черные и латиноамериканские районы я уже молчу, они есть наверное во всех крупных городах. В Канаде мне кажется их меньше и преступности следовательно меньше.

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 Добавлено: 29 ноя 2009, 19:48
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Я живу рядом с Детройтом. Тут даже городской автобус туда едет. Вот только не пойму почему там так много чёрных? Особенно в центре города!
Кстати то что в канаде меньше приступности это тоже можно в плюс канады поставить. Но хочу подчеркнуть что этот плюс достигается тем что люди получают пособия от госсударства. И человек который не имеет денег не идет воровать на улицу он безысходности либо от голода. Но опять таки это оплачивается с налогов. Вот и получается что в канаде каждый оплачивает и за своё спокойствие тоже.Что то типа страховки на спокойствие. Поэтому где лучше а где хуже точно вам никто не скажет. Не зря гласит пословица "там хорошо где нас нету".

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 Добавлено: 29 ноя 2009, 20:11
В Детройте много черных наверное потому что там центр автопромышленности, в которой активно было задействовано черное население еще со времен Генри Форда.
Что касается преступности, то главное опять таки большое число черных и латиносов. В США пособия тоже немалые выплачивается. Просто в Канаде нет не одного города где черных или латиносов больше 10%, а в США больше почти во всех городах. А те города которые я называл самыми преступными, в них они в большинстве. Вот в этом и проблема. Если смогу найти статистику осужденных в США, то увидите что из них черных и латиносов больше чем остальных, при то что в США они в меньшинстве.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographi ... _ethnicity
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographi ... #Ethnicity
У меня кстати, недавно дом знакомой из Атланты ограбить хотели. Ей позвонила соседка и сказала что чернокожий пытался вскрыть ее дверь, но у него не вышло, после чего он пошел к соседке. Соседка вызвала полицию, но грабитель скрылся, так как пробраться пытался через гараж, где сработала сигнализация которая его спугнула. Такие случае в Атланте очень частые. В Калифорнии я смотрел репортажи, большинство безработных черные, других почти не видно.


Последний раз редактировалось Alert 29 ноя 2009, 20:37, всего редактировалось 1 раз.
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 Добавлено: 29 ноя 2009, 20:32
I am a Canadian citizen, born in Canada and I immigrated to the US. I've been here for over 6 years now. There are pros and cons for both, and it depends on what you feel is important, and what stage you are in your life now. Let me summarize the difference. The decision is yours.

1) Health care - costs: In Canada its free. u go whenever you want, and get a checkup. In the US, you need to pay for insurance, or even if you employer is paying for most of it, you still have a premium (around $200-$400 per month depending on your company), and you also have a co-pay every time you go to a doctor. (about $25-$150 depending on what you need done.)

2) Health Care - Quality/Speed of coverage: In Canada you can go to any doctor you want, but if you need some specialized help, like a cat scan or an operation, you will need to wait in line and depending on the severity of your condition you might wait for months before a slot is opened up for you to come in. In the US, the doctors are competing for your money, so they want to get you in as fast as possible, so that they get paid. There are a lot more of these service available in the US, and so for example, if you were to wait for a cat scan in Canada for 2-6 months (depending where you live) in the US, you'll probably be getting the cat scan within 2-5 days. These are round numbers. I am just trying to give you a feeling that in Canada sometimes you will have to wait because of the overwhelming amount of people that are getting the limited amount of resources. In Canada, doctors are paid by the government. Their salaries are pretty much fixed. The best doctors leave Canad! a and move to the US because there they can get more money. So the BEST doctors are in the US, but you will have to pay for them.

3) Taxes - Taxes are higher in Canada. If you are in a 25% tax bracket in the US, then to be in the same standard of living your taxes will be in the 40% range in Canada. Property taxes in the US are generally higher though.

4) Social Services: The government needs to pay for the social service that they give their citizens such as Medicare, welfare, and unemployment. Although these services are offered in the US also, they are not as broadly accessible (i.e. its harder to qualify for Medicaid in the US, as only the elderly get it.) Also the coverage you get under unemployment in Canada is MUCH better than what you get in the US. Welfare is much easier to qualify for in Canada, and if you become disabled or sick, the Canadian government will take care of you. In the US, if you don't have insurance you might be on the street.

5) Potential income: If you are highly educated, extremely motivated, or a hard working entrepreneur, you will make more money in the US. There are more companies looking for highly skilled workers, and also if you are an entrepreneur, then the tax code is in your favor when compared to Canada. In Canada you will hit a ceiling, and its because the taxes imposed on your hard work will diminish your returns. In the US you will be able to make more as you work harder, and with a good accountant you will be able to pay less taxes than when you made less money (percentage-wise) If you have a medium to low education (if you have no university degree for example) then you will most probably be better off in Canada. The minimum wage is higher in Canada, and with free Medicare, this will make up the difference. u can still live fairly well in Canada if you are not educated. In the US, if you are not educated, and you can't afford good health insurance, then you will be nickel and d! imed by all types of things that are related to health.

6) Quality of life: Canadians, in general, value family life more than Americans. For this reason, your bosses in Canada will not require you to do as many over-time hours as your bosses in a comparable US company. There are more legal holidays in Canada. Companies generally provide more time off to their workers. (a typical Canadian company closes down for a 2 week period over the winter holidays, a lot less US companies do this for their employees.

7) Cultures / Racism: Canadians, in general, embrace the fact that their country is built on immigrants. The only "real" Canadians are the descendants of the indigenous Indians who were there when the land was discovered by Europeans. Americans, in general, seem to have forgotten this fact. u are considered American, and only American, simply because you were born here. ur traditions and culture are shunned, and should not be promoted. In Canada, the government provides millions of dollars to ever ethnic organization under to sun to promote their culture and get others to join in the celebration of their traditions. If you ask a Canadian "What is your nationality?" In Canada, everyone is Chinese-Canadian, or Russian-Canadian, or Italian-Canadian. Even though they may be born in Canada, they continue to be proud of their heritage, and others want to hear about their traditions also. In the US, you are considered either a foreigner, or you are American, its your choice on ! how you decide to sell yourself, but in general, nobody will accept the fact that you are an American, and you also want to keep your traditions from China. u are in America, so be an American, not Chinese, and that's it. For this reason America still has a huge problem with racism. If you look like a minority, or if you speak with an accent, you will be treated by many Americans as a second class citizen. Many more Canadians are aware of world events, even if Canada is not involved. Unlike in the US, where the news typically only speaks of US events, and world events that affect the US, like Iraq.

8 ) Education: Higher education in Canada is MUCH cheaper than in the US. Primary, and secondary education is, in general, of a slightly higher quality. If you live in Quebec, your children may be required to go to French schools, depending on where you immigrated from. For this reason the quality of the English schools (excluding universities, and colleges) in Quebec is much lower. Its rare that a Canadian student has a student loan that takes then 10 years to pay off, since the cost of years education can easily be paid off with a student's summer job salary. In the US, many students come out of school with a $40,000 loans or more that they need to fund.

9) Safety: Bottom line. There are no guns in Canada. There is less racism, and the availability of social services have reduced the amount of truly desperate people that generally commit these crimes in the US. Since the family values are generally embraced more, parents, in general, raise their children to respect others, and thus reducing the possibility of crimes later in life. Canada is safer, no doubt about it. It is a well know fact in the US, that if an American travels outside of the USA, they should have a Canadian flag attached to their bags. The world hates Americans a lot more than they do Canadians.

10) Weather: Canada is cold. If your not from northern Europe (and I mean north of the Baltic), or east of Poland, then you haven't seen what real cold is yet. Snow is a part of you life for half the year, and I don't mean just a couple of centimeters, I mean 20-30 centimeters sometimes. u'll spend a lot of time cleaning your car and shoveling your driveway. In the US, if you live south of Chicago, or south of Denver if you're in the mid-west, then you shouldn't ever see that much snow and cold weather. If you're not used to the cold, I recommend you take a trip to Canada in February to see what -40C feels like. The summers in Canada are beautiful, and most major cities have tons of festivals, or activities during these warm months to help people enjoy the weather before the leaves start to come down, and eventually it eh "Great White North" all over again. The US has tons of warm places like orida or California, or Arizona. There are also temperate places like North Caro! lina, and Virginia. Even New rk city is not even half as cold in the winter as the average Canadian city.

11) Unemployment: Unemployment, in general, is higher in most major Canadian cities when compared to most major US cities. Many students come out of university, and have trouble finding jobs. They may take a year to find a job. and even then the income is not generally enough for them to go live on their own. They need to live with their parents for a few years before they make enough money to get their open place. They may be there on average until the age of 24-26. This of course incurs costs on the parents for a longer time in their lives. In the US, college students get out of their parents house on average at the age of 18-22. Even a seasoned individual will need more time to find a job in Canada, than in the US. There are less companies, and there are more people in the pool looking for jobs at the same time.

Summary: If you are highly educated, and in good health. u have no kids, then the US is the best place for you. u can make more money, you won't pay a lot for health insurance, and you won't need to worry about your kids finding a good school.

If you are of medium to low education level, or you have health problems, or tons of kids, then Canada is the right place for you. u will find a job that pays better than in the US at this lower bracket, and the free Medicare will help you take care of your health issues and your kids. As your kids grow older, they will get a better, cheaper higher education, and then they can move to the United States to get a higher salary.

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 Добавлено: 30 ноя 2009, 01:33
Мне кажется, что Канада более мягче для начала иммиграции :) Хотя я сужу только по прочитанным мнениям на форуме. Наверно "начать" будет проще в Канаде. А уехать потом всегда можно попробовать. Конечно я говорю с позиции молодежи :) С детьми уже сложнее намного.
Я сейчас в Москве занимаюсь у репетитора, он прожил 6 лет в Канаде :) Теперь хочет свалить в штаты. Говорит, там уровень жизнь повыше будет.

Вчера был последний день подачи на Green Card в USA :) Мы с подругой оставили заявку,а вдруг :)

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 Добавлено: 30 ноя 2009, 07:58
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sanchower писал(а):
Теперь хочет свалить в штаты. Говорит, там уровень жизнь повыше будет.

Точнее будет: материальный достаток выше. Не так ли?

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sanchower писал(а):
Теперь хочет свалить в штаты. Говорит, там уровень жизнь повыше будет.

Точнее будет: материальный достаток выше. Не так ли?

А разве стремление к материальному благополучию является предосудительным?

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 Добавлено: 16 дек 2009, 23:19
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Если вы ищите спокойный уголок в америке с низкой преступностью - то добро пожаловать в Вермонт и нью-Гемпшир, правда там и работы не густо. Ещё в Юте почти нет чёрных - только мексиканцы и белые - преступность почти на нулевом уровне.

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 Добавлено: 16 дек 2009, 23:22
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spqr1945 писал(а):
А разве стремление к материальному благополучию является предосудительным?

Кажется никто не говарил что материальный достаток это плохо.

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 Добавлено: 17 дек 2009, 19:38
spqr1945 писал(а):
Ещё в Юте почти нет чёрных - только мексиканцы и белые - преступность почти на нулевом уровне.

Тоже самое можно сказать про штат Вашингтон. Там кроме того что не очень много черных и низкая преступность, там очень красивая природа, горы и тихоокенское побережье. И тихоокеанское побережье, кстати, намного красивее чем атлантическое.

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 Добавлено: 18 дек 2009, 00:27

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А как тогда Орегон, который находится южнее штата Вашингтон? Там, по статистике, мексиканцев ещё меньше, чем в штате Вашингтон.

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